Kreia

[jenmcnitt]

I have not seen this discussed here yet, but where does Kreia fall for getting legion approval?  She seems to fall in a grey area.   There are old posts on the Rebel Legion forums but at that time it seemed there was disagreement that she would fit there.

 

From the story line, seeing Kreia as just a disguise for Darth Traya also does not seem to fit.

 

What are your thoughts?  It would be nice to be able to find a home for her in one of the legions if possible.

[DarthValkyria]

Just so I am clear on the distinction, the difference between Kreia and Traya was the brown robes and ochre tunic vs the black robes and tunic of Traya, correct?

If so, then I would definitely say it is a grey area because *technically* she was dark side that entire time she presented as Kreia, but it was understood to be light side. I don't remember the specifics of the moment of reveal but the closest comparison I can come up with is how technically Darth Vader is approvable in the, "Anakin" form as he was dark in that attire. If she, "comes out" as dark side while wearing the outfit (again, too long ago to remember) then I would wager support for it being approvable for 501st under the aforementioned Anakin comparison argument. If it is done off-screen or away from an in-person player reveal, then I could argue either way for both eligible and not eligible for approval within the 501st.

[jenmcnitt]

20 hours ago, DarthValkyria said:

Just so I am clear on the distinction, the difference between Kreia and Traya was the brown robes and ochre tunic vs the black robes and tunic of Traya, correct?

If so, then I would definitely say it is a grey area because *technically* she was dark side that entire time she presented as Kreia, but it was understood to be light side. I don't remember the specifics of the moment of reveal but the closest comparison I can come up with is how technically Darth Vader is approvable in the, "Anakin" form as he was dark in that attire. If she, "comes out" as dark side while wearing the outfit (again, too long ago to remember) then I would wager support for it being approvable for 501st under the aforementioned Anakin comparison argument. If it is done off-screen or away from an in-person player reveal, then I would argue not eligible for approval within the 501st.

 

Yes, Traya has the black robes where Kreia had the brown and ochre tunic.

 

Spoilers to come for those who may not have played the game yet---

 

Kreia's history is complicated and she is a complex character. I believe her ultimate goal was to deafen/destroy the Force.   She may be wearing her Darth Traya gear at the end as the final 'boss', but it does not seem that her goals changed throughout the entire game under either persona. I am open to hear other views though.

 

The initial summary from Wikipedia for Kreia:

"She is a blind Force-sensitive who forms a "bond" with the player character, the Jedi Exile, through the Force. Kreia sets herself up as the Exile's mentor, and rejects the divide of the light and dark side of the Force, as well as the predestination the Force entails. By the game's end, it is revealed she is the Sith Lord Darth Traya and is planning on destroying the Force, and she becomes the final boss of The Sith Lords. Kreia makes no more appearances in Star Wars fiction, though a miniature by Wizards of the Coast was released in August 2008, and she appears as an obtainable character in Star Wars: Galaxy of Heroes."

 

From an interview with the lead designer, it seems that the goal for Kreia was to create a sympathetic Sith Lord.

 

Also from Wikipedia:

"After the player finds all the in-hiding Jedi Masters, Kreia will retake her mantle as a Sith Lord. If the player does not kill the Jedi, she will intervene when they attempt to cut the Exile off from the Force, draining the Jedi of the Force herself and killing them. If the player chooses to kill the Jedi, she will renounce the Exile.  Either way, she will leave, and the player must hunt her to Malachor V, the site of such great atrocities and death that they caused a wound in the Force. Kreia seemingly plans on creating another wound in the Force there, deafening all to the Force and causing its "death", as well as potentially killing all those touched by it.   The player faces Kreia, now "Darth Traya", as the final boss, and after she is defeated she offers to describe the future she foresees before dying."

 

Here you can see a video of what happened during the Light Side Jedi Council confrontation.   Kreia sure likes to monologue....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v416Ri38O7g

 

Throughout the game, I felt that Kreia was trying to manipulate the 'Exile' (your character) though but not necessarily with evil intentions in her eyes.   In one aspect she wants to train you so that your strong enough to face Nihilus and Sion.

 

Depending on your character's alignment and when you got to a certain level, she trained you on either light side or dark side prestige classes. Kreia is the only character immune to you affecting their influence level throughout the game. Her alignment stays neutral throughout.

 

Some additional reading that I found very interesting:

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/kotor/comments/6s9hmq/can_someone_please_explain_to_me_what_kreias/

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/kotor/comments/4ajb1i/was_anyone_else_pissed_as_heck_in_the_jedi_temple/

 

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Kreia

Edited April 6, 2021 by jenmcnitt

[TK7892]

Hey, was there ever a ruling on this? Kreia is clearly not a Jedi and not a supporter of the Republic. She set up the events of KOTOR2 down to the Exile’s return and Atris’s fall to the dark side. She was master to at least two Sith Lords, and also trained Revan. Kreia is as much a Sith Lord in KOTOR2 as Palpatine was in The Phantom Menace. At the very least, she would fall under dark side adept. She makes many references to this in the game. Just wondering if a Kreia costume would be approved?

[DarthValkyria]

I can submit the request to LMOs and get their verdict as they would be the final arbiters on it regardless. Plus, new LMOs and recent Charter/OP character alignment changes open up more options. Let me send them the info and I'll let you know when we receive a response after they vote (usually takes about a week).

[TK7892]

Thanks for the reply! Either way it goes, thanks for the help.

[TK7892]

On 4/20/2022 at 6:04 PM, DarthValkyria said:

I can submit the request to LMOs and get their verdict as they would be the final arbiters on it regardless. Plus, new LMOs and recent Charter/OP character alignment changes open up more options. Let me send them the info and I'll let you know when we receive a response after they vote (usually takes about a week).

Hi, any update on this?

[DarthValkyria]

We had an issue with our last year LMOs and things never got to the actual main LMO group for voting/confirmation, which put a set-back on several costumes this year. I have resubmitted and apologize for the severe delay in this. 

[DarthValkyria]

The LMO team has deemed that she is not eligible for addition to the 501st Legion.