Standards Discussion - TIE Fighter Factory/Training Gear

[Koda Vonnor]

Bravo on the write-up Pam. I like every part of it but one:

 

..."Order 67, Search, Destroy, Kota"...

 

...BTW: Where are things in terms of making this an accepted 501 character?

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but to put it in brief:

 

These standards will not be approved without a standard-bearer.

 

If nobody steps up and creates an exact duplicate of these reference pix, the costume will not be approved by the 501st.

 

Like Rahm Kota for the Rebel Legion, the recreation must come before the approval. Luckily, the RL's requirements for exact detail are not as stringent as are the 501st's.

 

So, who's going to be the Starkiller?

 

Order 67 target awaits... "boy".

[Guest Anonymous]

Careful how far you stick that chin out... old man.

[Guest Anonymous]

Well I know a few of us are working hard on this costume. I know I probably will not finish mine til around april. Due to money situation. I dont know how everyone else is doing though.

[Guest Anonymous]

So, who's going to be the Starkiller?

 

Order 67 target awaits... "boy".

 

 

I just got a job, and a pretty decent income, so I will hopefuly get on this really soon again.

 

In otherwords, Kota, I will be the last thing you ever see!*

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*Disclaimer: I in no way mean to threaten anybody. This is a joke pertaining to the plot line of the force unleashed in that Starkiller blinds Kota.

[Guest Anonymous]

"*Disclaimer: I in no way mean to threaten anybody. This is a joke pertaining to the plot line of the force unleashed in that Starkiller blinds Kota."

 

 

LOL

[Guest Anonymous]

I do want to add that I agree that the boots are black not brown. The hand wraps and boot wraps are also black, and are not frayed at the edges.

 

I still havent made up my mind about the cuts on him. From a trooping stand point, I dont want to have to put fake cuts and makup on my arms everytime I go troop in this. But from an accuracy standpoint, I do think it needs to be there.

[Koda Vonnor]

Careful how far you stick that chin out... old man.

...Kota, I will be the last thing you ever see!*...

[Guest Anonymous]

Looking at that reference photo Pam posted... the boots look dark brown. See the one that particularly shows the backs of his heels? There appears to be an extra strip of leather at the seam. Is that a loop for pulling on the boot?

[Twi'lek Pam]

There does appear to be an extra strip of leather on the back of the boots, but it does not stick out like a finger loop would, so I'm guessing that it's just adding strength to the back seam of his boots. (Or, to follow his most dominant tendency... to add another layer!) Did you notice that at the top front of the boots you can see an extra leather panel covering the front of the boots as well? It appears to be perhaps 3-4 inches wide and covers only the front. I don't think I would add either of those details to the standards, though, because they're so difficult to see and it's hard enough to get correct boots for our costumes as it is!

 

 

I have been studying the high resolution references extensively, and my conclusion is that the only black to be found on this costume is the t-shirt under his tunic... and even that I would make VERY DARK brown rather than black if I were to make this one. I believe that this costume is a lot like Anakin's, in that there are areas that appear to be black, but on closer inspection you find that they have the warmer tone of a dark brown instead. Even the belt clips and covertec pieces appear heavily weathered and brown-ish, rather than shiny brand-new black. I would give them a light wash of browns in various shades to tone the black of the plastic down and make them match the worn and dirty look shown in the rest of the costume.

 

Pam

[Twi'lek Pam]

All right... I have some free time to work on the standards again! (Well, actually I should be trying to finish our Baroness and Viper costumes in time for WonderCon in a couple weeks... but this has been bugging me, so I'll spend some time on it, too!)

 

Michael (chosen one) and I spent quite a while last weekend going over the details on this costume. I had multiple Starkiller pictures open on my computer, and we kept flipping backk and forth between them over and over again until we figured everything out. I think our greatest success was that we were able to pinpoint the accessories and locations of each belt, and we even figured out where all of those hanging pieces of leather were coming from! We spent a good half hour on the belts alone, making what I'd call a standards list, and what he called a shopping list!

 

Pam

[Twi'lek Pam]

.

 

Costume Standards for the Starkiller Training Costume

 

 

 

 

 

A Starkiller Training Costume Must Have:

(These costume elements are required.)

 

 

 

Short Hair:

* The hair is dark brown, and must be cut very short.

 

 

 

 

Special Effects Makeup:

* Special effects makeup should be used to create scars and dried blood stains.

* A cut or lightsaber burn approximately 5 cm long crosses the upper right arm just below the shoulder.

* Dried blood covers the back of the left elbow, with rivulets and smears showing from the upper arm down to the wraps that cover the forearm.

 

(Do these wounds show up often enough to be placed in the "must have" section, or are they something that ought to be in the "should have" section?)

 

 

 

 

 

 

Inner Shirt:

* The sleeveless inner shirt should be black or very dark brown in color.

* The inner shirt has a round, t-shirt style neckline.

 

 

Outer Tunic:

* The outer tunic should be made of a dark brown material with a strong twill weave pattern, such as bull denim.

* The tunic has a Jedi style V-neck overlap, with the right side tucked under the left.

* The left side of the tunic is unusually long, with a triangular shaped extension that wraps completely around the torso. The wrap begins at the left shoulder and goes across the front of the torso, under the right arm, and then diagonally across the lower back. The end of the wrap is hidden by the belts, and can be secured on the front left side in any practical way.

* The tunic sleeves are form-fitting and badly damaged.

* The left sleeve is torn off at the elbow. It reaches only to the elbow in the back, and hangs loosely over the forearm in the front.

* The right sleeve has three tears or cuts. One cut reveals the lightsaber burn on the upper arm. Another long tear is located over the right bicep, and a third is visible just above the forearm wraps

* The tunic fabric is heavily weathered, and should be stained to replicate the appearance of dried blood, sweat, and grime.

* A trail of dried blood just to the left of the spine goes down the back of the tunic from a small puncture wound just under the armor.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pants:

* The pants are made with the same dark brown fabric as the tunic.

* The pants are slightly baggy, and should tuck into the boots.

* The fabric must be heavily weathered, and should have a damaged area running across the outer right thigh, as if the fabric was snagged but didn't tear, or as if it were cut and then badly repaired.

 

(I'm afraid this is the best image I can find for the tear in the leg so far. I'll keep looking for something better. You can see the tear on the lower thigh, below his hand. A tear is just a detail, but it's the multitude of details like this one that make the training costume so distinctive!)

 

 

 

 

Fabric Wraps:

* The wraps should be made with the same type of fabric as the tunic and pants. The edges should be cleanly cut and should not be fraying.

* The wraps covering the hands and wrists are the same dark brown color as the tunic.

* The remaining wraps are stained in a heavily weathered combination of tan and grey tones.

* The strips of fabric used in the wraps may vary in width, but they should average around 3 to 4 cm.

* A wrap around the upper left arm ties at the back of the arm, and has the ends cut short.

* A wrap around the upper right arm ties in the front, and has a length of fabric hanging loose from the knot.

* The wrap around the left wrist is tied at the outside of the wrist, and has the ends of the fabric hanging free.

* The wrap around the right wrist is very long, and wraps many times around the gauntlet.

* The boots are covered with thick layers of fabric wraps. The wraps cover the entire shaft of the boots, and wrap around the foot as well.

* The ends of the wraps over the right boot should be tucked in at the top.

* The wraps covering the right boot should be knotted near the outer top edge of the boot. The ends of the wrap fabric should drape down from the knot, hanging freely to the ankle.

 

 

 

 

 

Loin Cloth:

* The fabric should be a medium brown, much lighter than the tunic and with a warmer tone.

* The loin cloth should extend just past the knees in the back, and it should reach to just above the knees in the front.

* The fabric should be heavily tattered and stained, especially at the bottom edges.

 

 

 

Armor:

* The armor is made in two pieces, with one piece covering each shoulder and extending up to cover the sides and back of the neck.

* The armor has a heavily weathered nickle finish.

* In the back, the two sections of armor are held together by a pair of dark brown leather straps that are located close together near the bottom edge.

* The gap between the armor sections is approximately 1.5 cm wide in the back.

* In the front, the two sections of armor are held together by a pair of side release clips that are located close together near the bottom edge of the armor.

* A leather strap goes under each arm. The straps are permanently connected to the bottom edge of the back sections of the armor. In the front, the straps are connected to the armor with side release clips.

* A restraining bolt is located on the left chest plate.

* Black scoring should be present around the bolt, flaring up toward the left shoulder. A trail of "oil" stain should run down the armor from the base of the restraining bolt.

* A series of rivet holes are located at intervals around the edges of the armor.

 

 

 

 

 

Belts:

* The belts should be made of leather that has been stained very dark brown.

 

* Belt One is at the top. This belt is approximately 5 cm in width. It has a metallic silver slide clasp on the front left side, and a side-release buckle at the center back. A tail piece of belt leather approximately 7 cm long hangs from the right side of the buckle.

 

* Belt Two is second from the top. This belt is approximately 4 cm in width. It has thin lines etched into the top and bottom edges of the belt. It has a side release buckle on the front right side, with a tail piece hanging from the buckle that is approximately 15 cm long. This tail goes over belt two, and then tucks under the rest of the belts. There is a metallic silver slide clasp on the back left side of belt two, and a tail hangs from this clasp which goes over belt two and then under the rest of the belts. This tail hangs nearly to the back of the knee.

 

* Belt Three is third from the top. This belt is approximately 5 cm in width. It has a side release buckle at the center back. A tail hangs from the right side of the buckle and hangs down to mid-thigh. A silver d-ring is riveted to the bottom edge of belt three. Located at the front left side, the d-ring is attached with two dark brown rivets which are visible on the outside of the belt. A metallic silver hook designed for holding lightsabers with d-rings is also riveted on the left side of buckle three.

 

* Belt Four is fourth from the top, and is nearly hidden beneath the other belts. This belt is approximately 4 cm in width. The side release buckle is located at the front right hip. No tail pieces hang from this belt.

 

* Belt Five is at the bottom. This belt is approximately 4 cm in width. It has a side release buckle located to the right of front center. A tail piece hangs from the right side of the buckle, reaching nearly to the knee. A second side release buckle is located on the back right side. This buckle has a shorter tail piece hanging on the left side which is approximately 9 cm long. A thin strap of leather is used to attach a silver d-ring to the top left side of the belt.

 

* A larger belt is worn draped on a diagonal line over the other belts. This belt is approximately 6-7 cm in width. Lines are etched onto the top and bottom edges of the belt leather. A large silver slide clasp is located at the front left which has holes or rivets located at the top and bottom edges. Shadows on the belt suggest that the slide clasp is attached only to the right side of the belt, hiding the cut edge of the leather, and then the left end of the belt goes underneath it. The left side can then be attached with snaps that are disguised by the slide clasp. A matching slide clasp is located at the center back of the belt. Four large swivel clips are located on the back of the belt, with two on each side of the slide clasp. These clips are riveted or glued to the belt, and they do not have visible release buttons. (They're not Covertec clips, because they don't have the hook used to hang the clip on the belt, and they don't have the side buttons.)

 

 

 

 

 

 

Gauntlet:

* The gauntlet must have a top and bottom plate. It is not simply the top of a "off the shelf" fett gauntlet (Still checking this part out.)

* The LED display should read "Order 67, Search, Destroy, Kota" as shown by the graphic provided by the creators of the character

* The gauntlet fnish is the same weathered nickle as the armor.

 

 

Boots:

* Dark brown boots with low heels.

* No buckles or laces should be visible.

 

 

 

A Starkiller Training Costume Should Have:

(These costume elements are highly recommended, but are not required.)

 

 

Lightsaber:

* The hilt should resemble the reference images for Starkiller's saber.

* If the lighsaber has a blade, the blade must be red in color.

* NO Unaltered Master Replicas FX sabers.

 

 

Boots:

* The boots should have a front panel that is approximately 7cm wide.

* The panel should be made of the same leather and color as the rest of the boots.

* While it is nearly covered by the boot wraps, the panel is visible at the top of the boot shafts

 

 

.

[Guest bassclarinets]

NICE WORK

 

Jen

[Guest Anonymous]

Thanks for printing these up, Pam!

 

 

[Guest Anonymous]

I'm not at all sure about the colour of the belts and the boots. They look black to me in a lot of the shots, and particularly the turnaround artwork provided by Pam (thanks for posting that BTW, saves me having to load up the game every time I need to see it!).

 

To me, it looks as though the whole costume started out black when new, but has gradually faded and dirtied up into the muted browns we see in game, but I think the leatherwork still looks black (although I do accept in some shots it look brown, but I think in these cases it is more to define the parts of the costume in certain lighting).

 

I can post screen shots to support this.

[Guest Anonymous]

Hi, I'm brand new here, and to the 501st in general. I had a question about the required material to use for the tunic and pants. While at my local fabric store the other day I came across a material called Calcutta. A lot of time, it's used in Jedi tunics, and it has a pattern on it that to me looks A LOT like some of the hi res photos. I was wondering does my material HAVE to be a twill or bull denim, or any material that looks like the photos? I'd love to use this Calcutta fabric if at all possible. Thanks!!

 

Bomber

[Twi'lek Pam]

Hi, I'm brand new here, and to the 501st in general. I had a question about the required material to use for the tunic and pants. While at my local fabric store the other day I came across a material called Calcutta. A lot of time, it's used in Jedi tunics, and it has a pattern on it that to me looks A LOT like some of the hi res photos. I was wondering does my material HAVE to be a twill or bull denim, or any material that looks like the photos? I'd love to use this Calcutta fabric if at all possible. Thanks!!

 

Bomber

 

If the fabric looks similar to the reference images, then it should be good to go. There is no rule that says that you HAVE to use a particular kind of fabric.... we're just trying to give guidelines for people to follow.

 

Pam

[Guest Anonymous]

AWESOME! Thanks for the quick reply. Again, as I am just getting into this, I was unsure of how stringent the guidelines for the 501st were. Thanks again, Pam! I'll post some pics of the material. We're going for the darkest brown possible, not black itself, right?

[Twi'lek Pam]

AWESOME! Thanks for the quick reply. Again, as I am just getting into this, I was unsure of how stringent the guidelines for the 501st were. Thanks again, Pam! I'll post some pics of the material. We're going for the darkest brown possible, not black itself, right?

 

No problem!

 

Yeah, the only part of the costume that is true black is the undershirt. The hand wraps are very dark brown. For those who would argue this point, I can see in the high resolution pictures that while the back sides of the hands could be considered black, the insides of the hands are decidedly lighter and warmer in tone, definitely dark brown. My interpretation of this is that they're trying to portray a darker staining/weathering on the backs of the hands, perhaps from the classic manly gesture of wiping blood from one's face with the back of the hand. I wouldn't turn away a costume with black hand wraps, but I truly believe that they are meant to be very dark brown.

 

 

Pam

[Guest Daritha]

Since I've studied the 501st Standards quite intense (while still waiting for the restraining bolt to be shipped *sigh*) I've stumbled over some things:

 

- First of all: Starkiller is now an approved costume but his reference pics are still in the R&D gallery.

- To the Standards: I've uploaded a better picture of the damaged area of the pants

- The "mistakes" (one typo and one description) in the text are the following:

 

[...]

 

Fabric Wraps:

[...]

* The wraps covering the left boot should be knotted near the outer top edge of the boot. The ends of the wrap fabric should drape down from the knot, hanging freely to the ankle.

 

[...]

 

Armor:

[...]

* Black scoring should be present around the bolt, flaring up toward the left shoulder. Two trails of "oil" stain should run down the armor from the base of the restraining bolt. The left trail should be smudged near the bottom edge of the armor.

[...]

[Guest Anonymous]

wow that is a very helpful list to work from! now all i need to do is save up a LOT of money to do it and find people in the UK that can make the armour etc........

 

in regards to the boots did you decide if the extra leather was essential or not?

[Twi'lek Pam]

in regards to the boots did you decide if the extra leather was essential or not?

 

The extra piece of leather is there in the references, so a complete and accurate costume would need it. It's an easy thing to add to the costume...you don't even need the piece to be very long. As long as it shows a bit above the wraps, you're good to go!

 

Pam

[Twi'lek Pam]

.

 

All right, I absolutely dread saying this.... but it's time for me to revisit this set of costume standards, get them finished, and get them approved for posting.

 

I've spent hours sculpting and fiberglass casting the Starkiller armor, I've spent many more hours studying the turnarounds and discussing them in intricate detail with a dozen Starkiller enthusiasts, I can easily sketch this entire costume from memory at this point, including every belt buckle and fabric tear... and yet the darned standards are still unfinished! (Honestly, these standards have been such a thorn in my side, I've kinda been avoiding them as much as possible. But, I'd like to get them finished and removed from my to-do list once and for all... so, let's get this rolling again.

 

Everyone, please take a look at the partially finished standards and let me know if you find anything that needs work still. I know there are some corrections needed, and a bit more detail in a few places... we just need to get them all figured out so that a final version can be typed up and approved.

 

About the belts: ONE hanging belt strap will be required. The rest will be in the "recomended but not required" area. That's an LMO ruling.

 

 

Pam

[Guest IC-7989]

For the loincloth (and if I missed the answer to this I apologize) does it have to be a cloth fabric or can it be a lightweight leather? I used a lightweight deerskin with good drape and just the right density. Its been dyed, distressed, burnt, and otherwise mangled but what is the ruling on the material itself? I can provide a picture if needs be.

[Guest Daritha]

So far, I'm pleased with your standards. Above I've quoted and corrected two little things but the fixed parts of the Standards are looking good to me.

 

To the debatable content:

 

The special effects make-up should be in the "should have" not "must have" section. It will be make the costume looking more realistic but should not be required as a must-have for approval of the costume.

 

I do think that the "Covertec Clips" are based on the normal covertec clips but without the hook. The side buttons could be included since the first approved Starkiller had them too. I'm unsure if we should that fussy there since there are so many (stressing) details in this costume.

 

The gauntlet could be described as a variant of the Fett gauntlet since it looks a lot alike to the Fett gauntlet but (again) many details are different.

 

To the boots: I think that the Anakin RotS boots should do it. They're looking a lot like the ones from Starkiller, I think.

[Guest Anonymous]

Very nice work. Exceptional research and very nice details on the various components. This is certainly a daunting costume and is even more complicated than an armored Vader!!!

 

Honestly, I’d like to do one of Starkiller’s costumes, but considering the complexity of the Training costume with the aforementioned requirements, I may look at other costumes!

 

I have a few comments regarding the standards. I make these because it seems with many of the costumes in the 501st and Rebel Legions that there are components that have excruciating detail while others (sometimes seemingly more important) are overlooked.

 

Must Haves:

 

-short hair?

I wonder why short hair would be a must…considering the standards for Anakin and Obi-wan do not demand hair/facial hair for Rebel Legion approval. Yeah-yeah, this is a 501st costume, but still. If I’m forced to cut my short hair even shorter for approval then I simply won’t make this costume for approval purposes. And what if someone has no hair. Will they be forced to get a short wig?

 

-special effects make-up.

I would suggest these be placed in the “optional” category. For me, the “must have” should be the worn costume components (and lightsaber) only.

-Outer Tunic:

I would hesitate to demand a specific type of fabric to be used for such a costume. I can see being very picky over costumes worn by live action actors, but not so much for animated characters. I would think that as long as the fabric has the right lay about the body and a proper thickness to avoid being see through, it should be okay. Not everyone has similar access to all fabrics.

-A trail of dried blood just to the left of the spine goes down the back of the tunic from a small puncture wound just under the armor.

Seriously? I think this is being a bit picky…perhaps one of those things that is being overly detailed. I didn’t notice this when playing the game. I don’t doubt it’s there, if folks say it is, but to include this as a “must have” for the costume is a bit much. Perhaps this should be an “option” like the make-up.

 

Should have.

-lightsaber

Really? Wow, he carries a lightsaber through the whole game. When he’s not using the lightsaber he’s tossing it around. I would think this would be a “must have” component.

 

Well, there’s my two credits worth. I don’t mean to offend. I just wanted to offer an opinion.