tk826

Not sure what is up with the open mouth icon thing as you originated the request on an alternative, and it seems all of the replies like the suggestion. You asked for it, it was discussed (including your humorous responses), then got what you asked for... now it's instantly a surprise? If that little icon is meant to show astonishment that your request was actually acted upon, fantastic. If it is meant to show surprise in the change, it's seems like a 180 on your previous position.

No effect on the SLD. Merchandise, roster titles, or anything like that would change. Just the title on the TFE CRL page to allow those here to personally refer to their SL's as something a bit different than the SLD SL's, in casual conversation. It also better encompass the variety of characters listed under TFE: SL.

Swiched DS from "Dark Force Users" to "Dark Side Adept". As of right now, I'll go with SL: Sith Legends, which you can change later if you decide to. * I thought about DarthTagion's suggestion of Slinky Lingerie but that would require some drastic changes in costume requirements.

I would think that it is a character which is officially recognized as entering the Sith order, and as such is a devout practitioner of that dark side religion. A note regarding the updated term of SL: I think it would be proper to have, on the main CRL category list, a term that better reflects the multitude of characters within it. "Saber Lover" was suggested, but I'm not sure if that is a formidable enough title (?) Like mentioned, the first that came to my mind was "Sith League". (But, my thoughts keep drifting toward either a sports league or the extraordinary gentlemen) Perhaps "SL: Sith Legends" ? * Legend (n) A person whose fame or notoriety makes them a source of exaggerated or romanticized tales or exploits.

Hey Steve, Have a scan over the last few posts. Under this idea, Starkiller (all Starkillers) would remain SL. I also mentioned the subject of retroactively removing what Disney might now consider non-canon characters, and that those of us on the Membership team would not even think of doing such a thing. Basically confirming what you posted. * I am also glad that you mentioned being one of the first to suggest a secondary designation for non-sith characters... and that it was 3 years ago. A re-evaluation of the designations (legion wide) is something that members have been calling for for quite some time, and as time passed the situation became even larger. We chose, this year, to finally take action on this long standing request to better organize characters and prepare for the future. Something that was long overdue.

Thanks a lot for the efforts. Likely no need to ask further details from Mr.Avellone. With this latest idea, they would not come into play. I wanted to give everyone a chance to catch up, before moving on. I think they have, and I will get to work on it.

I'm glad you mentioned this. I was going to suggest ... (and of course Thomas has already given it some thought) that for fun, either publicly or privately, you might consider a new meaning for SL. The first that came to my mind was "Sith League".

I do not have the game "Knights of the Old Republic II", but from all of the reference that I do have access to, Visas's story begins with the devastation of Katarr and she is immediately taken as the apprentice of Darth Nihilus. I would think that (like Galen) being an apprentice of a Sith Master, by default, places that character within the Sith order.

I believe Galen was first seen in the "Force Unleashed" graphic novel, which was release immediately prior to the video game. The first of his outfits is the TIE Training Gear, and he is "knighted" as Vader's apprentice within the very first few pages. This would mean (and please correct me if I am mistaken) that the Training Gear, and all costumes afterward would be considered Sith outfits.

If it is correct that Visas being the apprentice Darth Nihilus makes her Sith...Yes.

After some more discussion with Thomas, the membership team, various PM's, and all of you, I believe a revised version of the above "relaxed idea" is in agreement by all that I have spoken with. Please let me know your thoughts on this: SL = All Sith characters ... (Lord or not Lord makes no difference) DS = Dark Force characters that are not Sith. DZ = Characters that are none of the above. I would have to perform another round of research, on each character, to be completely sure, but I believe that right off the top... Visas, the various Strakillers, and Lumiya would head back. I'm liking it. Keeps all Sith together, keeps all non-sith together, no need to track down the smaller technical details in the future, and provides for easy organizing of those new characters that are inevitably on the horizon.

Someone just sent in the question... "When Disney redefines what is and what is not canon, will you be retroactively removing characters from the rosters?... Just curious." I am certain that I can speak for the entire membership team when I say, We would not even dream of doing such a thing.

* I must first say, I'm so happy you pointed out the word "chatting". I'm hoping that no one gets the impression there is anger involved in any aspect. Some side info on a few of the points mention just above: The CRL's... They were originally intended to by "Costume reference guides", open to at least some interpretation. During the last administration, an individual became a bit overzealous and made them strict requirements. I have, over the course of the last year sought out the opinions of each and every detachment leader, as well as many GML's, in an effort to relax the strict language that was added, over the two years prior. For example... changing the instances of the word "Required" to "Recommended". and, the phrase "must have"... to "should have". As of this day I have received not one disagreement with this idea. I believe Thomas is also a supporter of this. As it stands right now, meeting the base CRL's are a mandatory requirement for acceptance. This includes the "rule" that if there are changes to a CRL, those members have a year to make alterations, or risk having that costume removed from their roster. Personally, I have not and have no desire to, hunt down and remove costumes that do not meet the latest CRL standards. First, because of what I mentioned above, and second... I believe that all costumers in the legion strive to have excellent costumes. They, and those around them, continually make changes and updates,if and when they are able. I have also made great progress in bringing back to the detachments the ability to decide what is or is not included in a character CRL. The LMO team has made over 1500 changes, additions and updates to the various CRL's this past year... With he exception of photos (that come from individual members), 99% of those updates have come from within their respective detachments. Some detachments insist that the CRL's be very strict, even with minute details. Others are fine with relaxed standards. As stated, I feel that if those above words and phrases are altered back to their original meaning, a CRL can be as strict or as loose as any detachment feels they should be, because they will once again be GML "Guides" and not the "be all - end all" of costume requirements. Grandfathering... As The Clone Emperor and DarthTagion mentioned, it was determined to be a poor solution quite a long time ago, and I agree with that assessment. Letters... If all goes well, we have a new legion applicant building a "Force Hound". Another dark side force user, which is not a Sith Lord. "Preparing for the future" not only pertains to the upcoming films and television shows, it is happening (and needed) right now. What else... Wikis... Although information listed in a user editable wiki is often referenced by many, I personally do not rely on them. I make great effort to track down the original, individual sources of said information. I do use the wiki's to begin a search, but only to collect the "notes" which are listed at the bottom of the pages, to verify the original information. I'll leave this very casual chat post, with this... If a few of you (we have not heard any word from the other 95+ now DS members) so desire to call your characters Sith Lords, please submit... anything. We'll take a half sentence from the third level of a video game. (Sidious calling Maul "Lord", in the movie, was enough to keep him as SL) A passage from a role playing game instruction book, the editors notes from a novel... anything. The only character to have been moved back so far is one that I personally presented the information for. I have tried hard to find even the word "Lord" associated with any of the remaining characters, and just can not do it. Someone mentioned above... "We are the experts". If this information does exist, you are the most likely to be the ones to know where to look. If you can't find it... no one can. I can promise this.... If any info is presented, no matter how obscure (although not from a wiki , I will make sure the buttons are clicked, the moment it happens. * Also please consider the idea I had mentioned earlier, of making SL "All sith"...and DS "All non-sith". The Membership team liked the idea. (The "complications" I spoke of involve adjusting the DZ's accordingly)

I have Star Wars Tales #24. It is a collection of unrelated short stories. The Visas Marr story is titled "Unseen,Unheard" and is 6 pages in length. Here it is in its entirety: Pg1 Pg2 Pg3 Pg4 Pg5 Pg6 I'm thinking the quote from the ComicVine Wiki might be an internet user's misplaced edit. Maybe Heavy1973's email reply will have some more info.

Maul: He was discussed, but it was pointed out that in the movie, in the scene after Padme begs the Gungans for help, Sidious referrers to him directly as "Lord Maul". Visas Marr: Can you point to the source that ComicVine is pulling that reference from? "...should each of Starkiller's costumes be looked at separately due to the time and power/training at which they were worn?" I would think yes, and is the reason I feel (based on the reference I've shown above) that the Sith Stalker armor should in fact be considered a Sith Lord. This particular incarnation of the character does have valid reference as being referred to as such. * In an dedicated effort to find a common ground with those who are the most displeased, like mentioned above, we are currently discussing the pro's and con's of the idea of using a relaxed standard. This being "Sith -vs- Non-Sith", rather than "Sith Lord -vs- Non-Sith Lord". Although "technically" incorrect, (in regard to the term "Sith Lord") it would move several characters back, be they Sith Lord or not. But, it raises some other issues that would first need to be ironed out.